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Suicide: When It Hurts Too Much To Live

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  1. MyBrotherskeeper:

    If you are sincerely asking the question how to convince someone not to take one’s life, there is no easy answer, but it starts with the person accepting the need to resume sobriety. Over half, if not closer to 70% of suicides involve being intoxicated on a substance, to disinhibit usually, so to aid someone, the person has to be sober.

    Sober people usually attract sober supports, and that enhances a more positive and productive viewpoint. Unfortunately, people commit suicide, and many of them use substances. Until society, in my humble yet experienced opinion, accepts that intolerance of substance abuse has more to gain than lose, losses outweigh gains.

    People have to want help to get it. I hope your brother makes the healthy choice. I think it can be presented this simply, as direct and honest is the way to go. I wish you well in this pursuit.

  2. Dear skillsnotpills,

    Thanks for responding to my post.

    Since our mother died, my brother has been in detox and treatment (including a 60 day lock down) more times than I can count. He has told people that it doesn’t matter how many times they send him to treatment, he is going to start drinking as soon as he gets out.

    I know that his mental health issues are a big part of his problem yet it seems like none of the treatment providers try to treat that – they think that once he gets “sober” he will get better. I don’t agree but what can I do? He is at the mercy of state/county programs since he has no money or assets.

    My oldest sister (who my brother most recently lived with) says that this is just his way of getting attention and having someone come to his rescue once again. I have been through this with him before so I know that there is some truth to this. I have had to take a hard line with him over the years after burning out trying to help him right after our mother died.

    My siblings and I grew up with alcoholic parents who were very neglectful and abusive. For my own well being, I can’t be around the drinking.

    What are the options for someone in his situation? Detox is only going to get him sobered up but that is about it.

  3. MBK:

    Having worked as a consultant at an addictions inpatient rehab program for 3 plus years, if the patient does not want recovery, it won’t happen. I am sorry to say the following, but I am honest and direct, and it needs to be said: there are some who are what I call Terminal Addicts, who never find the bottom to start working up to recovery, and in my opinion, a lot of these terminal addicts will grab someone to take an innocent one with them. So, all I can say to be truly caring and invested to those who are caring and invested people, is know when to let go or cut the proverbial line to avoid being dragged down. Saying no, not continuing to do the same when it doesn’t make a difference, accepting the adage that “the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few” is not being selfish or mean, it is accepting reality.

    I hope your situation ends better than some that I have witnessed, both as a psychiatrist and family member. Just watch out for those who are equally chronic enablers, co-dependents, and not in touch with the realities of dealing with addicts. It is fascinating and disturbing to listen to those with the loudest opinions usually with the least experience or qualifications to comment.

    Be well, be happy, be prosperous.

  4. I have a son and he is what has kept me here. I am scared for what might happen to him if I leave. Being a single mom as the woman mentioned earlier has so many taxing things that come with it (his father is minimally involved).

    I am a full time student, full time worker, and a double time mom. Everything I do is for my child, and because of this I have lost myself somewhere in the last decade. I cannot find myself. I went back to school to do what I really wanted in life, but it seems an endless battle I have three years down and still have two to go. I am tired. I have always had these thoughts in the back of my head, but they are getting stronger.

    Even though I have a secure job it does not cover the bills. I am only 30 years old and feel as if I am 60. I don’t want my son to feel that I don’t love him enough to stay, I want him to know that he would probably be better off. Times are tight and he comes home crying because they make fun of him at school because we are “poor”.

    I have spent three years obtaining a BA in Sociology and in two years I will be a nurse. I put a good face on, it fools my co-workers at work who happen to be in the medical field and are trained to see through this. At home I tend to let my shield down to everyone but my son, not one person has seen my withdrawal from life. I know I am in trouble, but it seems no one else does.

  5. Monique, I am way too overtired right now to say much of any use, but I just briefly wanted to say to you that I heard you very clearly. You are just totally overwhelmed, and tired, like you say, and that is real.

    I know how much you love your son, but no matter what you try to hide from him, he knows it anyway. I only wish my mother had told me just enough about how depressed she felt when I was a kid, just enough so I wouldn’t have spent hour after hour worrying about her, and wondering what I did or didn’t do to make her better, and why every time when I finally made a difference, and she smiled, this would be destroyed once again, and again, and again no matter what.

    I also understand what you mean when you are thinking that your son may be better off without you.

    So, skipping everything else that may have been circling around in my mind just a few moments ago when I thought about you, and even felt you, let me just say this.

    The very best you can ever do for your son is take care of yourself as much as possible, and what will make him feel most happy and comforted and good is your well being and that you get well.

    god, do I know it is hard and it may seem just impossible to you right now, and I don’t blame you, and it’s even OK if you feel that way, and I don’t expect you to think positively, and listen to a bunch of advice that you cannot relate to, understandably.

    I am glad you told us how badly you are doing, because that is a first step, right? Take care, kiddo, I’ll come back here later. Katrin

    PS: I am a single mother and a nurse

  6. When I was in my early twenties, I was driving through the country with my father, and the subject of suicide came up, although more indirectly. I should add that I was extremely close to my father, always.

    So this is what he tells me, and I was as little prepared for this as anyone of you would/will be…the words that came out of his mouth.

    He said, that if I committed suicide, that would make him slightly sad, maybe, but not a lot, and that his life would go on as always; that my suicide would not really at all affect his life. (He was not angry, or in anyway emotional when he said this, and I could tell from his body language, and just knowing him well, that he really meant what he said.)

    At first I was sort of stunned, like I thought that maybe I had not heard correctly. I was in such disbelief that it took me a while to even feel hurt by what he said.

    Oh, and then he said that his adopted son from his first marriage, and who was not his biologically but rather his wives from an earlier marriage, had shot himself, (and I was aware of this), and that when he did do this, he, (my father) also did not suffer greatly about that loss and his life went on as usual. (and with those words, the conversation ended, or rather we switched to another subject)

    We were still driving together silently for quite a while, minding our own business, when something strange happened inside of me, and this was as unexpected as the words my father had told me earlier.

    I felt totally relieved about everything, and so glad my father had told me his side of the story, because he was basically giving me his blessing that I ought not feel concerned or guilty about what it would do to him if I killed myself, and which was rather nothing. I felt so free and so glad, and now I really could do it, right? But I also lost interest with all those words said, as there really was no longer such a pressing reason, either.

    My father’s word’s, and my subsequent realization, business cured me. (not edited)

    PS: I never said to him that this was what I was planning on doing, but he must have sensed the idea, and which already surprised me greatly by itself.

    By the time we separated that day, we were OK with each other, totally!

    (I didn’t tell this for it’s moral value but only for the value of what was my experience, and which was pretty unbelievable, and this is not an isolated case where an experience ….tired)

  7. I just watched the last 15 minutes of a show on HBO 2 tonight (Wed Aug 5, 2009) that ended at 9:30 PM, and I just offer to anyone seriously contemplating suicide to find out what the show is and watch it, and especially the end, because that is the legacy and how depression jades and discolors the truth in one’s life.

    And it is very painful to watch, so be prepared.

  8. Sorry I did not think about it until after forwarding the above post: Boy Interrupted, on from 8-9:30PM on HBO 2.

  9. I lead a very lonely life, suicide always comes to my thoughts. I know the amount of people that it will affect (family..no frinds at all), but they in their way have put me in this position (no blame though). When and if i do take the jump,pill or whatever… i know ill be doing it for me. I ve done the counciling stuff and all that, and am trying to improve muself so i can fit in this world but sometimes it just seems too daungting.
    I dont have bipolar or any other medical ailment, but i do know that im lonely and alone…and at 35 that dosnt bode well for the future.
    lots of arguments here about those who you left behind, but what about the individual that had the pain….? wheres his/her feelings (i know i cant ask!!) just remember when you tell them to get help etc, it sometimes just isnt the fix thats required.

  10. What is the fix that is required? What do you need?

  11. if only i knew :-(

  12. I have NEVER had issues with depression. But slowly the physical pain I am in is making me realize that I am a useless being.

    What good am I doing laying in bed crying all day?

    The pain medicine is hardly working, the pain is too severe to stand.. I do not know how much longer I can take it.

    I may be a burden upon my family in death.. but I am quite a burden upon them in life as well.

  13. I have had a number of sessions with a counselor for my anxiety, which also involved depression because of a breakup. The counselor suggested a book by Father Anthony de Mello, a Catholic priest from India. In his book, “Why We Love,” he said that friends and things cannot make us happy. That was key for me. Even people with lots of friends get depressed. Each of us has to be happy with our own individual person.

    I saw where I went wrong; I depended on another person for my happiness. We cannot do that.

  14. The way this society enforces its will even to the point of denying people in pain a way to end their lives with dignity represents a selfishness and arrogance that is utterly astounding.

    Euthanasia should be a right – to anyone after due consideration.

    Yes, it hurts the people around you, but to those of you who claim your departed loved ones left you with ten million times the amount of pain just come off as selfish in the extreme.

    I do not mean to belittle or scorn your grief but please try to understand that what you are expressing is an attempt to enforce your own desires upon someone else – even to the point of trying to control how and when they die.

    It is their decision. Not yours.

    With that out of the way,Personally;

    I’m successful, I provide for my family but there is no meaning in it. I exist solely for the purposes of others. Is it in any way fair that I am to be constrained in this miserable lifestyle just because people feel like I literally owe them MY LIFE?

    I do not like the society I live in, I don’t like many of the people I’m surrounded by and above all else, I don’t like myself. Therapy sessions, medications…hobbies and interests… they all become simple distractions. Reaching out to people doesn’t always work and it is foolish to claim that it will work in 100% of cases.

    It is possible to tie up people endlessly chasing some form of cure or another, referring them from psychiatrist to psychologist, playing russian roulette with antidepressants- but their feelings about life, and the entire structure of their minds are sometimes things that are set in them from birth, maybe even possibly before birth. The uncomfortable truth is that there are simply people around who do not want to live.

    Why do we force them to, surely this is the ultimate form of incarceration?

  15. i have been trying my hardest to find my path. there is no light at the end of the tunnel that im in unfortunately. couselling hasnt helped…only made my feelings worse…go figure!!
    time for me to move and and give somebody else a crack…..lifes a bitch then you die!

  16. I won’t go into details about my own struggle with this issue. What I really want to know is: Where is all this help everyone tells you is out there?? I have bipolar disorder but I haven’t received an actual “diagnosis”. I didn’t make it far enough with the therapist for him to commit to it, he said. I have no health insurance now. How is someone like me suppose to get help when they don’t want to feel this way? One big factor for me is knowing I will never be able to get treatment for what is making me miserable. So it stands to reason the misery itself is permanent. Who in their right mind would want to live that life?

  17. Hi – I found this site because I typed into google, “PTSD + parental suicide”. I don’t know why it popped up but it did. My father took his own life over 27 years ago when I was just about to turn 12. I believe I have lived in survival mode ever since, on red alert, fearful in the world, insecure and since my mother died 2 years ago, the anxiety has at times turned to numbness, darkness with no hope, emptiness and lack of any meaning. Parents are important, not only to young children but always, connection to our humanity is is important and its not easy to be human these days, to feel the permission to feel depressive thoughts, it is not encouraged that feelings and thoughts do change, there is no faith in the power of feeling connected, belonging and good enough just as you are to others. I believe there is a great deal of seperateness in our world today, judgement and un-acceptability.

    I do believe that people have the right to choose to take their own life but the effects on others of suicide, if sudden and un-expected are devastating, the legacy for me seems to be that I do not trust life, have a hard time making it work for me – my role models didn’t talk about the hard bits and certainly didn’t make it through them. I wish my father had spoken to me (I know this is un-likely) but the mystery, the cut offness of no-one expecting this makes me feel really sad, that his choice, his existence was somehow not real – that he was never truely in the world.

    it is worth being in the world, awake, not asleep and I do think I understand living in a hald-dead state is almost no better than not having life. But please, think about expressing yourself to those that love you, in some way, even if you are fearful.Even if you dont understand what is going on, even if you have no hope, you are here and if all you have is to express your experience, this is valid, it is real for you and i encourage it from my corner of the globe.

  18. I want to die ! Not to die but to rest , my head my body my emotions I want to switch them all off. Why you
    may ask , all I can ever remember int life is a need to be accepted and loved for me. Always tried to be what someone else wanted me to be just for the love and acceptance , I am nearly 40 now and still I strive for them I feel like a triangle in a world of squares I feel as I have watched my life from some one else eyes critising and pulling apart every gesture every word every action I have ever made all as to not hurt anyone as they have hurt me over the years I wish I did not care about anyone feelings or what they thought of me but I do and it confuses me even more even now I want to die I worry my children will hate me but I just can’t go on no more and if I don’t take my own life my life will take me evantually as it so bad from as far back as I can remember to all the people who have crossed my path all the people I looked for good in, and found none you all have my blood on your hands I gave nor to recieve but I gave because I thought you was like me and I was wrong cos if you was you could not of hurt me disrespected me or abused me physically mentally or emotionally but you did and once again I was let down . I wish for happiness I wish for love I wish to be understood and I wish some one would hear me. Godbless. X

  19. I was married for 23 years, during that time i committed adultery numerous times… (what a creep i know), we are now divorce and the guilt and shame of my actions are with me everyday. my 2 children want absoulty nothing to do with me. My ex hates me with such a passion and says that she want me dead…. So i sit here trying to find a reason to live, I have no reason to live no more for the pain that I have caused to my family. I dont know if I will be here tomorrow but I will say this, my sin has killed me and I will kill me.. the guilt and shame is endless for i deserve death for all the pain I have caused…….

  20. nobody deserves death and everyone has done things that they are ashamed of. And who’s to say if you had to creep then that says that there was something you were not getting at home. And as far as your kids they will come around, and stop feeling so guilty as they grow up they will experience things that will help them understand you better.trust me I know now what my mother went through and why she divorced my dad happiness.

  21. I had depression when I was a teenager. I was sexually abused as a child and molested through Grammar School, because I was different. The only thing worse at that time was, that I knew I couldn’t commit suicide. Every time I attempted to end my life I stopped at shallow cuts. Luckily my life has changed (which doesen’t mean I don’t fancy death at times). I still want to escape sometimes, but I will never take that path knowing there are other alternatives.

    TOM: Sins can be forgiven

    I’m willing to listen to everyone of you. If you need to be heard, feel free to contact me (I’ll keep on reading the posts). I will keep you in my prayers.

  22. This will be very long, but I think it shows you how suicide isn’t so bad or selfish. Suicide is absolutely my answer – I am just having trouble having the guts to do it only because it can never be re-taken. If you do it right you never get another chance.

    I was born and raised catholic, and I am surrounded by a number of people who love me. However, I am seeing some of those who I considered to be close to me starting to walk away even though I still act the same as always. I’ve never even cried once. I grew up lower/middle class where I could never even treat myself to a $100 purchase without having to put it on a credit card and pay interest. The house I grew up in was built brand new (2000 sq ft) nice in appearance but 5 years later my parents almost lost everything (but didn’t lose the house) with a failed business. My mom had to go back to work for the first time in 17 years to save our family via health benefits. This shamed my dad since all their peers (family and friends in their age group) had made big money and were climbing fast – no wives worked. Although these people were kind and gracious my parents still could not associate with them anymore……Ultra-expensive dinners, vacations, etc. So it was only the money that omitted my parents from this group, and this crushed them. Again, the people were nice enough but my parents weren’t going to go out with them and be the token “charity case”. My dad fell over with his very first heart attack at age 55 and died. This devasted us with constant tears and deep sadness.

    Simultaneously, I was continuing to make good money, and I knew how happy that made him before he died and while he was in “heaven”. I would be able to look and seem successful – and my mom would be proud as would the many extended family members who place emphasis on money as a real man’s worthiness. Yet, these same people go to church every Sunday so they must be Jesus-like, right? At my financial peak in ’03 I had a high level of net worth and no debt anywhere in sight. I have now lost all of it and am in six-figure debt on top of it – collection calls, visits etc.. I put anything I could in the house rehab of a traditional neighborhood in one of the most well-known and established cities in America. The house hit the mill$ mark in ’03 and my siblings and I thought how great it is to keep this in the family for generations. The value has crashed so far that I’ve lost all $$.

    Plus, before that happened I opened up a 2nd business as i saw real potential. I could not have even predicted (in my worst estimation) that the business could have done that bad- I was out of there in 18 months, losing far more than I envisioned. Moreover, the first business,which made me quite successful at one time, now suffered via a corporate giant that opened 500 feet away (yes – that close). It’s worse that this happened 10 months after I bought out my partner’s share in the business. I would have been able to give him nothing for it had we known that the business would have faced adjacent competition – after 10 years of us being in business there.

    I truly admire the words of “Mur” because they don’t blame others for where they are. Mur said it right in that you can notice the people in your life having less to say to you because they are so uncomf with what has become (in my case) an impoverished life and getting worse. Every employer checks credit reports now unless you are, say, delivering pizza – and no that wasn’t meant to be insulting. I’m just saying that with my bad credit, and nothing more than a Bach degree from ’90, I have no option except to live with my mom and probably file bruptcy.

    Why? because it would take me 20 years to repay this debt and thats if I did it aggressively via high paying job. Think about this- I knew by age 28 that my anxiety and fear is so bad in my life that there is no way I should ever have children. Wouldn’t it be such a waste to NOT commit suicide when I have the perfect set up as a single adult whose now 41? Carbon Monoxide in the garage, and take something beforehand to make you extremely drowsy. Put a soothing cd in the car stereo and before dawn – presto, you are gone.

    There would be plenty of notes to leave and that would take a couple of weeks – fine. Mail them, say, on a Tue morn and go out to the garage late that night. By Wed at 6 am, I have no more debt, no more pity from people, no painful realization of the fact that between 2 bad investment choices and an unprecedented tragic economy, I lost everything plus hundreds of thousands in debt.

    Like “Mur” said, you need to realize that even those who love you most have their own lives to worry about and you can’t expect these people to have special daily time set aside for you. I really like that point because I would like all of you to think of yourselves for a moment, too. If someone you loved was really in a horrible depression, how much would you help them?

    I know I would do all I could but then I would start getting annoyed if they would start calling me late while crying, or showing up at my door crying etc etc. Again, as sympathetic as I am I would tell them to get help at this point -so I do know that I have become a burden to people now. Do you want to throw me the old “Oh, Kevin you just want people to feel sorry for you for how they treated you”.

    Guess what? At 41, nothing could be further from the truth. For what it’s worth I have had a blast at all 4 of my class reunions, and no one who truly was cruel to me during HS was even close to that behavior by graduation June ’86, let alone at reunions. That’s why a teenager taking their life seems so wrong as they haven’t lived long enough yet.

    Why haven’t I mentioned going therapy for help? Is it because I never tried it? My God, there is an on/off paper trail of psychologists going back to ’84. As for psychiatrists (they are just there to prescribe meds) this goes back to ’94. As it stands, the 7th medication attempt is the first one that ever helped. But, it doesn’t help enough. As for the actual counseling – what a joke. I have been through 8 therapists. Let me tell you….just by meeting them for the first time, as long as you shake their hand and look them in the eye as you introduce yourself and have a neat clean appearance, they can’t take your problem(s) very seriously. Why? Imagine Ally Sheedy’s role at the very beginning of the Breakfst Club movie – that’s what they are used to seeing – except people much older than her who act that way. You seem like a very minor case to them if you are pretty functional.

    The therapist I am seeing now is so hung up on the fact that I once had money (this man is very wealthy) that he actually said the following: I told him about a dynamic successful long time friend of mine who makes $150,000 per year, and my therapist said “Now, that’s somebody who you should stay close to – you need to stay in his back pocket”. So even my therapist is basically a smug money-grubbing person who looks down on the lower class. I say this because of other comments I’ve heard that didn’t offend me- but I remember them. This wealthy friend of min e has become uncomf and cringing of my situation so I can’t stay close w/ him – he is fading gradually, but I’m not blaming him.

    I need to swallow more pride here to get me out of this…living w mom for 2 years, filing bruptcy, women who seem to like me get disinterested when they know I’m unemployed even though I say it as “cool” as one could without seeming panicked or happy. Yet – they walk from it without words, so imagine if they knew the FULL PICTURE nightmare of my finances. Again, like “Mur” I don’t begrudge these women as that’s just how it is – we must be accountable for our decisions and mistakes – don’t blame others. Between relatives, friends, and acquaintances, there are about 500 people who would be shocked. About 400 of these people are those I might only discuss the weather with as I only see them once every 12-18 months. Another 60 people I know more in depth – but I need to be careful to not embarass the family or my pride, so there are limits with what I say or admit. The last 40 are those close to me in varying degrees.

    Just like some of you have already said, it’s just as selfish for people to expect you to stay alive when there is no hope for you, as it is to end everything – and act in your favor. We have different problems….but here is what my suicide would mean for me:

    1) All debt is gone- and it’s only in my name so they can’t go after anyone else.

    2) The emotional pain of how I lost a huge net worth is now done.

    3) Realizing that women I’m interested in don’t want me because of the financial mistakes I made goes away.

    4) The slow learner I am at positions I’ve had caused a real uproar in corporate america. I was transferred twice (at work) to other cities due to my nervousness and tendency to panic. So it’s not like it was “all in my head”.

    5) Self-employment was my answer to not dealing with #4 above but even there I felt uncomf dealing with any slow employees because I know how sensitive they were – since I’m that way. Since I came off as patronizing, I have a few ex-employees who hate and dis-respect me all because i was trying not to be an asshole WASP type of businessman. Although I’m a nice person with a funny and original sense of humor, I am too weak and fearful and ashamed to be able to stay here. I refuse to be homeless or be the old guy who lives with his mom.

    In one 4 hour session of running my car while I’m asleep, this all goes away. The notes that everyone will receive from me (40 or so people would get these) will absolutely emphasize thanks to them and how much I loved them and that there was nothing more they could do, so don’t feel guilty. Yes, this was lengthy but I think it shows that suicide can work. I would do this far from the holidays and far from Mother’s day just so there is no sadness of affiliation with my death. Just the thought of getting out of this place called life is euphoric – think of the tingling excitement of being a young kid on the last day of school and all of us kids would be counting the seconds/minutes till that last bell will ring, signifying the start of summer vacation.

  23. It’s me – Kevin, again. After reading my story, I forgot to mention one key detail. The woman I was in a relationship with for 2 1/2 years broke up with me 5 months ago. No, I am not leaving out any key parts of the story like I stole from her or hit her. Nothing could be further from the truth. She would say the same.

    The fact is both of us always had credit scores in the 780-820 bracket and it was killing her to watch me with two failed businesses and mounting debt. She cried when we broke up apologizing that it’s just too hard to be in this kind of a relationship at 40 (her age). It’s too hard to watch me spiraling down the type of financial nightmare that college grads normally deal with when they finish their doctorates – but at least they climb out within 2 years of their profession. Most of my family and friends loved her which is why they really are somewhat backing away now – they don’t know what to say. I must repeat that it’s not their job to say anything so I am not bitter at them or my ex.

    While I could fall in love with a woman who drives an older used car and makes 15K per year, a woman will not typically love a man in the same spot. That’s just how it is – nobody’s fault. It will be this way the rest of my life unless living with my mom……hence suicide.

  24. Bipolar disorder is not a “personality style!” It is a neurological mental illness. Please don’t perpetuate these types of misinformation about a serious illness.

  25. Kevin – I read your posts, rational, thought out and make sense, what about the next story line? Can you see that the story line you are in at the moment could end – without taking your life. A new one begin, that you dont even know about yet. Perhaps an ending is needed, but perhaps there are other ways. I am an aspiring writer and much of what I want to write is about what I percieve as the unacceptables in life, the things we dont say, the lives and twists and turns of fate that somehow make us “unacceptable” – your writing sounds like this theme is driving your plan of how to deal with it. Why not carry on writing? Your writing seemed very real and true to me and may take you out of this place, without actually ending your life. Your point about not being selfish comes across that you dont see your self this way, it sounds as though you are a kind person, but what about what you bring to other peoples lives – even if you think you dont? I enjoyed your writing, honesty and truth and i am sure you have more to say and share that makes the world make more sense to you – beyond the norms and acceptablility. Sally

  26. Kevin, it’s Sally again – the context with which I write and live is that my father took his own life when I was only 12 and I am sure he would have had a rational and quite reasonable explanation – he was intelligent, successful but I think he thought it was all a game, life – the success! I will never know, as he did not write anything or speak of anything, but I have lived with the shame and unacceptability from others all my life – it has made me a better person in a way – but it sure did make me an outsider too. I resonate with your situation, I resonate with the option you feel you have and indeed you do – but I also hold a new thought, that there ARE different ways to live, it is hard to go against the expectations and storylines laid out for us of what is safe and secure but perhaps that never suited you and with a new way, your fear and anxiety will cease. I believe that LIBERATION can come in life as well as death and I miss my fathers spirit on the earth too much to believe he should have left. Sally

  27. I wish I’d found this while Mur was still posting. And Kevin. And Elsa. Not to “talk you out of it,” but because your experiences resonate so strongly with me.

    I’m a 43-year-old female, 2 days left on disability for major depression/anxiety/panic attacks/social phobia. No health insurance (I live in California) so I can’t afford the meds or more importantly the psychiatrist and therapist appointments. I paid cash, and always paid. My last visit, my therapist gave me numbers for low-cost therapy, and wished me well for getting back to work. Knowing I am still debilitated by fear and self-loathing. When he talked to my psychiatrist (finally, after 10 months of therapy) 2 months ago, to help me get more time, he “got the impression” that she would not give me any more time. I know her office has a three-month limit on disability. So if you don’t get better in 3 months you are SOL. Silly me. Didn’t get better on schedule. I would go 5150, but that would drain the last teeny bit of money we have and REALLY make things worse. So I guess I am too functional to be on disability. The thought of going back to another office fills me with such fear and dread – I guess I shouldn’t worry, if I died of a heart attack it wouldn’t be suicide and nobody would feel guilty!

    I don’t have any children. That is a source of pain for me, but fading – at least I don’t have to feel guilty for being a bad mother. I do have cats whom I love as children, but often I think that if my body could be ground and frozen I would be more valuable as months worth of cat food than I am as a stupid, fat, nervous, self-absorbed useless broken cog left over from the meaningless offices I’ve worked in.

    People do love me. I have a wonderful family. My sisters have children, and houses, and happy productive lives. My parents have always been supportive and proud of this loser. I have an extraordinary, loving man in my life, and amazing friends who know and accept me as I am, and love me. Everything wrong is in my head. But it’s ALWAYS there, stabbing at me, reminding me of my worthlessness and whininess and stupid stupid inability to fulfill what used to be potential. When it gets really bad, I start hitting myself in the head, hard, to try to shut it up. I feed so bad for my man, because he’s the only one who’s seen that, but sometimes I just can’t stand myself.

    I will probably never kill myself, because I can’t afford enough therapy to be that selfish. Funny, huh? I hope Mur realized that suicide negates most life insurance payouts. They think of everything. Stay alive, because it’s what good people do. Stay productive, because the rich need their peons. (last 2 sentences = dripping sarcasm in case it wasn’t clear.)

    I really wish Elsa and Mur and Kevin were here, but there are others of you whose writing touched me too. Please talk to me. It helps so much to not feel alone in my head. It helps to feel like someone else. It would help to help someone else feel less alone too.

  28. …and Christina Webb and Suzanne and anna. Silver, maybe? I wonder why I can’t get anywhere when I click on the few whose names are links.

  29. Silly me, I thought the title referred to physical pain…which I am in and have been in for 12 years due to inoperable spinal tumors caused by a genetic disorder called neurofibromatosis. Visit my blog at NFpain.blogspot.com to learn more.

    I am in uncontrollable pain that cannot be described. Nothing works. Nothing. Drugs, acupuncture, reiki….you name it, I’ve done it.

    I don’t think I COULD kill myself using my drugs, my tolerance is too high now. But it does not make me ‘high’ or loopy or anything. It doesn’t do anything anymore. And if I thought for sure that it would relieve my pain and that I would not be inviting ‘bad karma’ I’d kill myself in a heartbeat….my last heartbeat.

  30. The Jews killed themselves rather than submit to Roman slavery. Samurai killed themselves routinely for failure.

    Frankly, most people lead miserable lives, and I would rather DIE than lead the life of some slum dweller in Delhi.

    Those of you who think life is so precious, I encourage you to imagine yourself as a sex slave in Pakistan or a starving child in Bangladesh with AIDS.

    Life is precious… sold to you.

  31. im am a teenage girl with a bipolor diorder. i have suicide thoughts constantly and thinks im worth nothing. i have had a rough childhood. my parents are divorced me and my parents fight almost everyday, i just recently got dumped by my ex that was with for more then 15 months, and i still love him, my parents would call me evil or heartless, and is teased at school, i cant take this life anymore i just wanna get it over with… ive been to 3 therapist and nothing ever works. the only solution or way out of this left is suicide…

  32. Something I would like to bring to peoples’ attention. Is that those who are suicidal sometimes do not realize the pain they will inflict on those they leave behind, this is true.

    But the point I would like to bring to light is that many of them do know. And knowing the pain they themselves are in. And knowing that they need to escape the pain that has been plaging them. And knowing the people it will hurt, sometimes only makes it worse.

    It brings an even more brutal and painful inner turmoil, knowing our body will be left behind for someone to dispose of and mourn over. For those of us who do realize this, we hurt more than ever before and this does not help us. So I wish people would realize this and please stop saying things like ‘I wish they could have known the pain we feel now’. Because we do think about that. And it kills us even more.

    But regardless, although our loved ones get left behind and many begin to suffer pain from our loss… You are still LIVING with that pain. We could not. We COULD NOT live with our pain. That’s why we die. And we are so apologetic for it, we really are. We don’t want to hurt anyone else. If we could kill ourselves and dissapear from memory and dispose of our own bodies, we’d die more often successfully, and be less scared, and in less pain.

  33. I don’t know if anyone is still responding to these posts, but I am humbled and moved by all of the stories on this post. For one, I know that I am not alone, and that people can feel hopeless for a number of reasons.

    I suffer from severe depression and anxiety at the moment. I too feel I have done everything I can to be well and move forward with my life. Without going into all the details, I guess I would say it’s important to keep trying no matter what.

    I don’t know how I’m going to solve my current situation, but I have to keep trying. I too have suicidal thoughts because I want to escape the pain, and am not sure what the future holds.

    But for the sake of others and myself, I cannot and will not take my life. I feel like it’s too cruel to myself, and like others have mentioned leaves behind so much grief. But I also want to say that I completely understand why people commit suicide and consider it as a serious option. I too consider it A LOT.

    Today I went for a 30-minute walk, and if I can keep that up, maybe the depression will recede so I can decide what to do next. Currently I’m taking baby steps to come out of this episode and dysfunctional life I have been living.

    In brief, I had to leave school; I was working toward a teacher’s credential in special education and had to withdraw because anxiety and depression became severe. I’ve had a lot of other disappointments (I’m divorced and tried to complete a Phd in the past but because of health issues including depression wasn’t able to.)

    I feel a lot of shame about not having a career (I’m 40 years old), sometimes I blame myself for my lack of success, which just makes the depression worse.

    After reading all these posts, I see that I must continue trying each day, each hour, each minute. I hope and pray that everyone who feels hopeless finds hope, everyone who feels pain, finds relief, and that we all experience moments of joy and happiness, however fleeting it may be.

    Something that helps me (when I’m open to it) from Buddhist teachings is that our thoughts and feelings are always changing, so they are not real and solid, meaning that we don’t have to take them so seriously. This is of course easier said than done especially with serious mental health challenges, but for me, it offers a bit of space from the constant churning of my mind, and invites me to let it go, even if it’s just for a few moments.

    Thank you to anyone who reads this and for all the previous posts,

  34. Suicide is a terminal solution to solvable problems. They may be problems that are not quickly or simply solved, but they almost always are fixable. And it starts by seeking out reponsible and invested others to help. Because if you could fix it yourself, you wouldn’t be contemplating suicide, true? This has been quite the thread I have read over the past 9 months or so. So, I hope those with enough faith and hope will consider my comment. Good luck, and good life!

  35. Hi, I don’t know if anyone is still responding to this conversation. But, I would like to share my story. First off, I’m not sure I could commit suicide. I have never really been suicidal. I do have chronic, sometimes, severe depression. I have had this for many years and have often wanted a long period of NO more! Now, its very different. I am 55 now. I have lost my husband. However, the last 3 years was almost a battle to see who could last the longest. I have severe arthritis. I was first diagnosed in my very early 20’s. It’s everywhere. There seems to be no bone and especially no joint not highly afflicted. I would watch my husband dying and think he was almost if not very lucky. It doesn’t seem like anyone understands. I can do nothing but be trapped in this body that never knows freedom from this horrid pain. I can’t commit suicide and be the reason for such pain in my children. Sometimes, I think of you people that condemn everyone that commits suicide as just plain selfish. Where is the mercy? My pain could go on for another several years. Why is this a better choice for me? Did I do something so terribly wrong that I should be tortured for this long. The pain has been severe now for over 15 years now. I can no longer get out of bed without severe breath taking pain. I lay in bed and scream and with every muscle and strength I can muster to just turn my body to release some pain. I take strong narcotics just to write this to you. I am not nearly to the end of this disease unless maybe my heart or something just gives up. I was an artist. My fingers and hands hurts. We sure won’t mention how ugly this disease looks as the ugly pales to how it feels. Yes, I am angry. Why has there been so much hatred toward ending a life so wrecked with pain. I too have been immersed in these thoughts and am now trapped. I realize there is no answer and I sure don’t expect one. There just isn’t one. But maybe someday we can find a way to help stop the pain without a horrible stigma to the families left behind.

  36. Hi Janet,

    I don’t think you should feel guilty for your suicidal thoughts. You are in a lot pain and you want relief. It’s understandable.

    I too am in a lot of pain (emotional), and today I am not having a good day. I am thinking that I want to die, that I can’t take it anymore. But like you I am reluctant to take that step because of the pain it would cause. I find for myself that dealing with my life the way it is is so difficult, so I go on the internet and google what i’m feeling, and then I just read different things all day. I spend hours doing this instead of focusing on what needs to get done. I know it’s not productive or useful but I don’t want to deal with my life the way it is.

    I’m sorry for your pain. You are not alone. Please keep going and try your best in each moment, that’s all any of us can do.

    Wishing you love, joy, and a pain-free body and mind,

  37. I make no illusions I cannot treat people over the internet, I am just advising people seek out care so they can remember how to care, not only for themselves, but see others do in the ways they can best. Pain management is a subspecialty now, and there are doctors who do it responsibly and effectively, but it takes time to diagnose and understand the patient.

    In my travels, when pain is framed appropriately, patients work through it. You need allies and people who will reinforce faith and hope.

    The one patient who made me think hard about suicide as an option at least accepted taking her own life was not a healthy option, as her terminal cancer pain was terrible to witness, but, she could not take her own life. She just did not understand asking another to do it for her would cause anguish for that other. When we were done talking, I sensed she respected that, and when she died about a week later, all who were around her were hopefully at as much peace as was the patient.

    Did someone assist her? I’ll never know, and I am glad I do not. But, death is a final choice. Make sure you exhaust all the others!

  38. I am an individual(35yr old male) who will suicide as soon as i have earned enough money for the disposal of my remains. I can personally say that I believe that some people just aren’t cut out for this life, not everyone is perfect or intelligent or beautiful or successful. Some of us just fail constantly even when we try our hardest. There comes a point in every persons (like this) life where they just have to ask themselves…’how can i make this stop?’.

    Well as we have probably found out by now, its not the worlds fault, its our own, we can’t change or else we would have by now.

    So there remains only 2 options, suffer and take others down with your misery, or be brave and end the hurt.

    Its not that we don’t want to live and be happy its just that we aren’t able to.

    Hope that explains why we do what we have to do.

    We need peace.

  39. The posts say suicide is due to mental illness, cultural bias, pain due to adverse life events emotional, physical, financial and professional.

    I have a friend who is a quadraplegic. She has severe medical problems that prevent her from enjoying a sort of normal life she makes a heroic effort to sustain. She wants to die before she is put in a nursing home. I have to agree with her that she has the right to do this.

    I suffer from pain from chemo for leukemia. Also grieving over my out of control teen. My spouse doesn’t seem to have empathy. It hurts so much sometimes I can’t breathe. I am heavily medicated which seems to be the solution to all emotional suffering. I don’t want to wake up. I talk to my counselor. We focus on the positive. Then I leave and feel like escaping.

    I have a few friends who listen but I feel guilty for asking for their attention and ashamed of my inability to cope. Everyone would rather watch TV.

    What seems to work is escaping, walking, even planning a trip that won’t happen.

    Society is not set up to prevent or help live through suffering. We are alone too much, tuned out too much. It’s Orwellian. Move to a place where the suicide rates are lower like a tropical sunny place.

  40. “When It Hurts Too Much To Live” is more than just a ketchy title for me….I am in physical pain due to inoperable spinal tumors from a condition called neurofibromatosis. It effects everyone differently, but for me, it means tumors all over my body and pain that CANNOT BE ADEQUATELY DESCRIBED OR CONTROLLED.

    I’m getting closer to it, I can feel it.

  41. It’s so sad and scary how I stumbled upon this website. I have been crying all day, as I have been for months. A few months ago I escaped a long term abusive relationship with a psycho, and am now almost 36 and alone with two kids. I am hopelessly in love with someone (new) who barely seems to have any time for me. When I found this website I was in the middle of a crisis: I wanted to die. For every reason imaginable, for no reason at all. I thought my “someone new” was my knight in shining armor…it seems to be rusting and I feel like I’m losing my mind. I prayed that god would just erase me like some sort of mistake. Am I depressed? Who knows. I just know I need a support system that just doesn’t seem to exist for me.

  42. Does anyone else hate waking up in the morning and look forward to as much sleep as possible just to escape? Do you wake and for one split dreamy second you’re in that zone, but then get yanked and thrown face first into that lonely pit known as your life? It’s like a realization and the most intense disappointment you can ever feel. But as a single mom you have to wake up, fill up the tank with caffeine, get to work. Then go to work. To come home afterward and continue working with no energy. And have no one to cuddle with, complain to, share the load with, talk about the day with, nothing. That’s what I think about at night. And all day. Which is why I love sleeping. And why sleeping permanently seems so appealing. No, I’m not going to do it. But when will I stop feeling this way?

  43. Your article is pretty well thought out, but it misses more severe scenarios. I am one of these scenarios. Cancer tumor on spinal cord, surgery to remove and radiation/chemo to treat, metal rods from T-1 to T-6, nerve damage, intractable pain, years of suffering, debilitation, no chance of working, isolation, no friends, no family, can’t take care of myself, 53 years old, poor health and getting worse, can’t exercise, a drain on your spouse, mental decline from years of pain, pain every moment of the day, trouble feeding yourself, no way to get better, can’t feel pleasure due to nerve damage, even reading hurts your neck, incontinence, bathing and eating tires you out, there is more but I will stop. I would just like to open the eyes of anyone reading this so that they may see that there can be such a time in one’s life that voluntary death makes sense, is a rational decision. There is a need in this society for assisted death or suicide, peaceful and painless. Our medicine is too good. We can keep people alive beyond the will to live, beyond one’s capacity to endure pain. We can’t alleviate the pain either. We will keep people alive unnaturally, but then we will not help them to die “unnaturally,” no matter how great their suffering. Quality of life must matter, and a competant individual must be allowed to decide when that quality doesn’t exist anymore. Thank you for raising this topic. It has immediate implications for me.

  44. The decision to no live anymore can be one of thoughtfulness and intention. I am in my midforties and have given this great thought in the last several years. After over 20 years of misdiagnosis, many, many medications, and all of the side-effects that have cost me so much time-time lost with my children- especially my youngest, who having lost his father to suicide then lost his mother to a drugged up delirium his mother in a doped up sleeping/drunked state spending her days in the dark, watching TV, eating and putting on huge amounts of weight. So not only did this young man lose his father at the age of 9 but by the age of 13 he essentially is being completely neglected by his mother who had trouble caring for herself except for in the most basic ways.
    I have been experimented on like a lab rat for so many years – with so many medications, lost so many jobs because I was so no many medications, some on totally toxic levels – that I know now- I did not know then.
    I lost all friends, contacts, All those who had been my friends on my way up – from welfare mom- to independent successful working mother, owning my home, financial independence, being elected Mayor of my city– those people they fell away very quickly – like I had the plague-
    Today, after some minor medical issues that have been resolved, I have no professional references from those times in my life. No one will return my calls or emails. I have no friends. I am not being melodramatic. I have no friends. The phone does not call. I get no email. I am utterly and painfully lonely.
    Ijoke, but it is true, I pay someone to talk to me-once a week-therapist.
    So when I consider my life- the second half of it, my children are off on their own. To college, to their own adult adventures and this is good.
    So there is just me. I have not had a partner in over 12 years. I am very lonely and have ached to be touched in such a very, very long time.
    So, to with thought and intention consider: is this to be my life? to be continually tweaking medications to find that “moment” of peace I had versus these weeks of dis-ease: anxiety, tension, terror, depression, isolation, utter loneliness, to have my life be such a public thing now that I cannot go any where with out a commentary, without stares and a running report on how I am doing in that moment which is what drives me to stay inside my sanctuary.
    I have no job. I hate where I live. I want to be were there is no snow, no 6 months of darkness, ice, cold and snow.
    So, yes, my friends, I have and do consider that it is time to entertain that my time here has come to a natural end. I do not believe that life was meant to be such a daily struggle. And do not offer, natural remedies, I employ them, exercise, done that, do that, eating right, that too, therapy, medication, meditation, yoga, support groups, I have tried it all, and my life simply does not work.
    Nothing in the last two years has worked. I have been homeless with my son. I have worked in autoparts store that made me physically sick. Did not feed my soul, did not feed or house us, we still qualified for state aid, the shame and embarrasement of that.
    So YES I do believe there comes a rational and reasonable evaluation of a life. What can be reasonably expected. I am 46 years old. I am tired. My spirit is so weary. If this is what I am to expect. The next half of my life to be so involved/inmeshed with the healthcare system- that in itself being so toxic, to be struggling for those “moments” of peace– fleeting moments in alifetime??? Not worth all the pain, the loss
    My children reject me. They do not speak to me.
    My daughter has not spoken to me in over 5 years. My son for the last year.
    I have no one else.
    My own family does not accept me- that being that I told the truth about the sexual abuse in my family. That is an unacceptable truth, therefore. I am crazy and the rest of the family is fine. Y’all get that right?
    Suicide. Choosing to end life before the torture becomes more than the quality of life. I argue that commense, responsible and thoughtful approach to this can come to a conclusion that runs in the face of the catholic crap that I have been told about selfish ness. It is not selfish to not be a burden anymore to one’s children. It is not selfish to not cost the taxpayers anymore money on countless medical costa for medications that simply cause a person to endure – not to thrive. Where is the goal in psychotherapy for the patient to THRIVE>>>
    If I cannot thrive? Than I am not living. I am surviving, just getting by, moment by moment… so the life support is the medication, the dr visits, the therapy… we have simply brought the whole issue of when we pull the “plug” vs the quality of life to the arena of psyco care- and we march forward telling ourselves that we are helping people? ARe you really helping someone who’s every day is painful… to live another 20 years in that pain? ARE you a hero for that? I think not…. I think not…
    I chose not to continue a life of suffering and contend that the suffering of my mind as we have worked so hard to legitimize mental illness as a real illness than does it not posit that mental illness can be included in a condition for a DNR in that I do not wish to be kept alive on drugs that do not give me any quality of live????
    I know I do not want to live another 20 years like this… and do far nothing has seemed to give me consistent hope of any difference in the quality of life. In your middle life, with no one around you, facing a world alone, no job, no future, being in constant pain because of physicalcondition, is continueing in this direction with no pause to consider an alternative course a wise decision. I think not. There are choices. And I do have the right to decide about my life.

  45. I am very depressed and have been for a long time. I have very few friends and a family who really doesn’t love me. I have tried very hard looking for love from them and I feel as long as i agree with them everything will be ok. My son who always treated me wonderful has stopped caring for almost a year. I was rushed to the hospitol earlier this year for a serious diabetic attack and he never called me. He notified the rest of the family and I guess he calls that he done his part. We went camping with him and when I was joking about food he started to yell at me so loud and embarressed me is when i knew he invited me to go camping aagain so he could say he did his part. I am so tired all the time and so unhappy. Living for me is not living. It is going through the motions to make it through the day. He went overseas to visit his in-laws for a month and he never visits me. I do not get to see my grandchildren. I always kind of wish that God would think its time for me to leave this world and do it for me. Lonliness is a disease and one that people cannot understand unless they experience it themselves. Everyday is the same as the day before.

  46. I am through with life. I am married with no kids, and have no reason to go on with life. I have nothing to live for so why be here! I have such a strong desire to die. I think about it daily. I think after the holidays I will do it. I will not be missed. I only have a sister who is 20 yrs older than me and she has not been to my house since Christmas yet lives 3 miles away. we have only talked on the phone maybe 5 times this year. So you see why be here. Life hurts.

  47. When I read the above comments, I can see that the conditions some unfortunate people live in made them think that perhaps suicide is preferable to a life of suffering, due to bad conditions.

    My case is slightly different. I come from a rich loving family, have quite a few friends and enjoy the things life has to offer. Unfortunately when I want to do something I don’t do it… don’t ask me why, I don’t know. When I have good intentions or intend to do something intelligent I end up doing something evil or stupid and sometimes it even works the other way round. The resulting feeling of which is that I have aboslutely no control over what the consequences of my actions are.

    I resent this failure and incompetence and intend to end it one way or the other… wouldn’t be surprised if I failed ..heh.

  48. My 16 yr old tried, but thankfully didn’t kill himself.
    I am eaten up with guilt. We have had a tempestuous relationship for a while.
    I now know the reasons,(my fault.) but he has chosen to move out.
    I have failed him.
    Now I feel like not living. I won’t do it, but the pain of living is horrendous. It is like torture.

  49. I have a genetic disorder called neurofibromatosis (NF). I have numerous tumors throughout my body, and the ones on my spine are inoperable and cause pain that cannot be controlled or described. I have also had breast cancer, a rare stomach disorder which required surgery, and they are keeping their eye on my thyroid (cancer) and my other breast.

    I don’t belong here. I never have, but the physical pain isn’t why I want to move on. I just don’t fit in. anyway. I am unmarried, childless and have no career. I have friends and family, but I am isolated and alone most of the time.

    I write, I read, I go online….you know, it isn’t because I feel sorry for myself that I want to die….it’s that I don’t fit in. Never have. Never will

  50. I have suicidal thoughts all of the time. I have terrible financial trouble and often think that most people would have already killed themselves. Not sure if I have OCD as I have signs of it but no diagnosis. Not sure if my obsession is from my life or my mind. I have every reason to live but find myself wanting to drive off a cliff or shoot myself all of the time. Readind all of this helps me know that I am not the only one living through this. I feel like I am doing prison time.

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